Revealed: The most dangerous roads in Warrington for cyclists

Warrington Guardian: Revealed: The most dangerous roads in Warrington for cyclists Revealed: The most dangerous roads in Warrington for cyclists

THE town’s most dangerous hotspots for cyclists have been revealed.

Data obtained through a Freedom of Information request by the Warrington Guardian to Cheshire Police has identified the locations in the town where there have been clusters of cycling collisions between 2009 to 2013.

The junction of Fennel Street and Mersey Street has racked up the most accidents in the town between 2009 and 2013 with 11 collisions taking place with five categorised as serious.

The junction of Lythgoes Lane and Battersby Lane and the junction of Hollins Lane and Watery Lane were named in joint second with three accidents recorded for each.

From 2009 to 2013, there have been 402 accidents in the town involving cyclists with 78 noted as serious and one resulting in a fatality in 2011.

But, it can also be revealed that for the past three years, the recorded number of cycle accidents had dropped from 96 to 75.

Figures also show the most dangerous time for cyclists to be on the road in Warrington is on a Wednesday morning between 8am and 9am with 13 cycle collisions reported at this time.

In a bid to make the roads safer for cyclists, Warrington Borough Council has looked to provide provisions to help protect cyclists and to improve routes around the town.

Cycle maps, which highlight the routes suitable for cyclists depending on their level of expertise, are available as well as identifying off road cycle paths.

Free cycle training is also available for all abilities to ensure cyclists feel more confident on the road.

Mike Carlin, from Cheshire Cycles in Appleton Thorn, has stressed the importance of keeping your bike clean and oiled and checking your bike over before heading out.

He said: “The popularity of cycling has exploded this year so prepare for the worst and buy a helmet. Always check your bike over as brake blocks can become worn and tyres can crack.

“Wear protective clothing and kit yourself out with essentials like a pump, repair kit and carry money in a handy saddle bag.

“Book in for regular servicing as staying on top of this can highlight small issues before they become dangerous ones.”

To celebrate national Bike Week, Cheshire Cycles, who have been providing services for more than 10 years, is offering a service worth £60 to get you bike ready for the summer.

To enter answer the following question and email the answer to lauren.hirst@nqnw.co.uk or via post to Lauren Hirst, Warrington Guardian, The Academy, 138 Bridge Street, Warrington, WA1 2RU.

Which country does the Tour de France start in this year?

The deadline for entrants is June 26. Newsquest terms and conditions apply.

For more information on bike week turn to page....

The statistics Most accidents happen when the weather is Fine 87% Rain 9% Fine wind 2% Rain wind 1% Most accidents happen when the road surface is Dry 77% Wet 23 %

Comments (18)

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8:52am Thu 19 Jun 14

brabazon says...

Cyclists are the worst road users going, most have no lights at night, no HV clothing and show no regard whatsoever for other road users. Try driving through Dunham Massey on a Sunday when the Cycle Clubs are out in droves, holding traffic up riding 3 or 4 abreast. Wigan Council have spent a fortune putting mirrors up on traffic lights so you can see a cyclist on the your left, the only problem is there are not many cyclists as in Warrington.
Cyclists are the worst road users going, most have no lights at night, no HV clothing and show no regard whatsoever for other road users. Try driving through Dunham Massey on a Sunday when the Cycle Clubs are out in droves, holding traffic up riding 3 or 4 abreast. Wigan Council have spent a fortune putting mirrors up on traffic lights so you can see a cyclist on the your left, the only problem is there are not many cyclists as in Warrington. brabazon
  • Score: -9

10:27am Thu 19 Jun 14

kazrobo says...

There has been a huge rise in bikes I see on the roads around Warrington. With the light mornings and nights they aren't so bad but the about I saw in Winter with no lights on riding on the road with no high visability vests, dressed in dark clothing. Helmets should be law they don't realise the risk they have if they bang their head. Its law in Australia.

A huge number don't acknowledge traffic lights or ride off and on the pavement so suit. What worries me if they cause an accident they have no insurance...
There has been a huge rise in bikes I see on the roads around Warrington. With the light mornings and nights they aren't so bad but the about I saw in Winter with no lights on riding on the road with no high visability vests, dressed in dark clothing. Helmets should be law they don't realise the risk they have if they bang their head. Its law in Australia. A huge number don't acknowledge traffic lights or ride off and on the pavement so suit. What worries me if they cause an accident they have no insurance... kazrobo
  • Score: 1

12:20pm Thu 19 Jun 14

JonWya says...

Dear me, the same tired old nonsense on a story about cyclists being victims of dangerous roads.

I suppose I should at least attempt to point out some valid points against the comments so far.

1. 'Worst road users going'. Really? How many people do cyclists kill and maim every year? What a silly statement. Drivers kill 3000 people a year and maim tens of thousands. Want to revise your statement yet? If one person a year is killed by a cyclist, that's an unusual year.
2. 'Cyclists holding up traffic'. Every single day there are huge queues holding people up coming in and out of Warrington. Every single day. Bloody cyclists eh? oh no, hang on. It's cars. My mistake.
3. Not many cyclists in Warrington. Not to my reckoning. I see loads but fair enough, that's an anecdotal piece of evidence
4. Helmets should be law. Australia is used by cycling advocates as exactly the reason why helmets shouldn't be mandatory. It stops people cycling, it makes it look dangerous (it isn't) and it actually increases fatalities. There's strong evidence to suggest that by mandating helmets, far more people die from obesity related diseases as a result because they stop cycling.
The most common place to receive a serious head injury is inside a car and yet no demands for car helmets...

Look, I'm not having a go guys but any suggestions that cyclists are any worse than car drivers is simply nonsense. It's the same people. most cyclists have a driving licenses, it's sometimes they ride a bike as well. We all share the same roads but as this article shows, cyclists are far more vulnerable than car occupants so all that I ask is that drivers respect that cyclists have a right to be there, appreciate the difference they make to the traffic on the roads and just give a little space and time when you see a cyclist.

You could even try cycling to work yourself. Warrington has some excellent cycling infrastructure and it really is very enjoyable, not like driving to work is.
Dear me, the same tired old nonsense on a story about cyclists being victims of dangerous roads. I suppose I should at least attempt to point out some valid points against the comments so far. 1. 'Worst road users going'. Really? How many people do cyclists kill and maim every year? What a silly statement. Drivers kill 3000 people a year and maim tens of thousands. Want to revise your statement yet? If one person a year is killed by a cyclist, that's an unusual year. 2. 'Cyclists holding up traffic'. Every single day there are huge queues holding people up coming in and out of Warrington. Every single day. Bloody cyclists eh? oh no, hang on. It's cars. My mistake. 3. Not many cyclists in Warrington. Not to my reckoning. I see loads but fair enough, that's an anecdotal piece of evidence 4. Helmets should be law. Australia is used by cycling advocates as exactly the reason why helmets shouldn't be mandatory. It stops people cycling, it makes it look dangerous (it isn't) and it actually increases fatalities. There's strong evidence to suggest that by mandating helmets, far more people die from obesity related diseases as a result because they stop cycling. The most common place to receive a serious head injury is inside a car and yet no demands for car helmets... Look, I'm not having a go guys but any suggestions that cyclists are any worse than car drivers is simply nonsense. It's the same people. most cyclists have a driving licenses, it's sometimes they ride a bike as well. We all share the same roads but as this article shows, cyclists are far more vulnerable than car occupants so all that I ask is that drivers respect that cyclists have a right to be there, appreciate the difference they make to the traffic on the roads and just give a little space and time when you see a cyclist. You could even try cycling to work yourself. Warrington has some excellent cycling infrastructure and it really is very enjoyable, not like driving to work is. JonWya
  • Score: 21

2:11pm Thu 19 Jun 14

Tony 187 says...

JonWya wrote:
Dear me, the same tired old nonsense on a story about cyclists being victims of dangerous roads.

I suppose I should at least attempt to point out some valid points against the comments so far.

1. 'Worst road users going'. Really? How many people do cyclists kill and maim every year? What a silly statement. Drivers kill 3000 people a year and maim tens of thousands. Want to revise your statement yet? If one person a year is killed by a cyclist, that's an unusual year.
2. 'Cyclists holding up traffic'. Every single day there are huge queues holding people up coming in and out of Warrington. Every single day. Bloody cyclists eh? oh no, hang on. It's cars. My mistake.
3. Not many cyclists in Warrington. Not to my reckoning. I see loads but fair enough, that's an anecdotal piece of evidence
4. Helmets should be law. Australia is used by cycling advocates as exactly the reason why helmets shouldn't be mandatory. It stops people cycling, it makes it look dangerous (it isn't) and it actually increases fatalities. There's strong evidence to suggest that by mandating helmets, far more people die from obesity related diseases as a result because they stop cycling.
The most common place to receive a serious head injury is inside a car and yet no demands for car helmets...

Look, I'm not having a go guys but any suggestions that cyclists are any worse than car drivers is simply nonsense. It's the same people. most cyclists have a driving licenses, it's sometimes they ride a bike as well. We all share the same roads but as this article shows, cyclists are far more vulnerable than car occupants so all that I ask is that drivers respect that cyclists have a right to be there, appreciate the difference they make to the traffic on the roads and just give a little space and time when you see a cyclist.

You could even try cycling to work yourself. Warrington has some excellent cycling infrastructure and it really is very enjoyable, not like driving to work is.
the most important thing you didn't bring up

all ROAD users should have insurance of some sort.
whether its a 3rd party of some sort.

Lights should also be compulsory

OH wait they are yet most riders dont use them

and a quote from talking point


While cars kill five times more pedestrians than bicycles, a rather different picture emerges when "serious injuries are measured as a proportion of distance travelled", the paper says. Cyclists injured 21 pedestrians per billion km travelled in 2012 compared with 24 pedestrians injured by drivers.

Read more: http://www.theweek.c
o.uk/uk-news/57065/c
yclists-almost-likel
y-injure-pedestrians
-cars#ixzz355ezvOfI



as for helmets i agree it must be your own choice more so since the transport minsters i think it was put out a statement saying helmets dont help stop injuries, but for anyone under 16 it should be compulsory.
[quote][p][bold]JonWya[/bold] wrote: Dear me, the same tired old nonsense on a story about cyclists being victims of dangerous roads. I suppose I should at least attempt to point out some valid points against the comments so far. 1. 'Worst road users going'. Really? How many people do cyclists kill and maim every year? What a silly statement. Drivers kill 3000 people a year and maim tens of thousands. Want to revise your statement yet? If one person a year is killed by a cyclist, that's an unusual year. 2. 'Cyclists holding up traffic'. Every single day there are huge queues holding people up coming in and out of Warrington. Every single day. Bloody cyclists eh? oh no, hang on. It's cars. My mistake. 3. Not many cyclists in Warrington. Not to my reckoning. I see loads but fair enough, that's an anecdotal piece of evidence 4. Helmets should be law. Australia is used by cycling advocates as exactly the reason why helmets shouldn't be mandatory. It stops people cycling, it makes it look dangerous (it isn't) and it actually increases fatalities. There's strong evidence to suggest that by mandating helmets, far more people die from obesity related diseases as a result because they stop cycling. The most common place to receive a serious head injury is inside a car and yet no demands for car helmets... Look, I'm not having a go guys but any suggestions that cyclists are any worse than car drivers is simply nonsense. It's the same people. most cyclists have a driving licenses, it's sometimes they ride a bike as well. We all share the same roads but as this article shows, cyclists are far more vulnerable than car occupants so all that I ask is that drivers respect that cyclists have a right to be there, appreciate the difference they make to the traffic on the roads and just give a little space and time when you see a cyclist. You could even try cycling to work yourself. Warrington has some excellent cycling infrastructure and it really is very enjoyable, not like driving to work is.[/p][/quote]the most important thing you didn't bring up all ROAD users should have insurance of some sort. whether its a 3rd party of some sort. Lights should also be compulsory OH wait they are yet most riders dont use them and a quote from talking point While cars kill five times more pedestrians than bicycles, a rather different picture emerges when "serious injuries are measured as a proportion of distance travelled", the paper says. Cyclists injured 21 pedestrians per billion km travelled in 2012 compared with 24 pedestrians injured by drivers. Read more: http://www.theweek.c o.uk/uk-news/57065/c yclists-almost-likel y-injure-pedestrians -cars#ixzz355ezvOfI as for helmets i agree it must be your own choice more so since the transport minsters i think it was put out a statement saying helmets dont help stop injuries, but for anyone under 16 it should be compulsory. Tony 187
  • Score: -1

3:02pm Thu 19 Jun 14

JonWya says...

Tony 187 wrote:
JonWya wrote:
Dear me, the same tired old nonsense on a story about cyclists being victims of dangerous roads.

I suppose I should at least attempt to point out some valid points against the comments so far.

1. 'Worst road users going'. Really? How many people do cyclists kill and maim every year? What a silly statement. Drivers kill 3000 people a year and maim tens of thousands. Want to revise your statement yet? If one person a year is killed by a cyclist, that's an unusual year.
2. 'Cyclists holding up traffic'. Every single day there are huge queues holding people up coming in and out of Warrington. Every single day. Bloody cyclists eh? oh no, hang on. It's cars. My mistake.
3. Not many cyclists in Warrington. Not to my reckoning. I see loads but fair enough, that's an anecdotal piece of evidence
4. Helmets should be law. Australia is used by cycling advocates as exactly the reason why helmets shouldn't be mandatory. It stops people cycling, it makes it look dangerous (it isn't) and it actually increases fatalities. There's strong evidence to suggest that by mandating helmets, far more people die from obesity related diseases as a result because they stop cycling.
The most common place to receive a serious head injury is inside a car and yet no demands for car helmets...

Look, I'm not having a go guys but any suggestions that cyclists are any worse than car drivers is simply nonsense. It's the same people. most cyclists have a driving licenses, it's sometimes they ride a bike as well. We all share the same roads but as this article shows, cyclists are far more vulnerable than car occupants so all that I ask is that drivers respect that cyclists have a right to be there, appreciate the difference they make to the traffic on the roads and just give a little space and time when you see a cyclist.

You could even try cycling to work yourself. Warrington has some excellent cycling infrastructure and it really is very enjoyable, not like driving to work is.
the most important thing you didn't bring up

all ROAD users should have insurance of some sort.
whether its a 3rd party of some sort.

Lights should also be compulsory

OH wait they are yet most riders dont use them

and a quote from talking point


While cars kill five times more pedestrians than bicycles, a rather different picture emerges when "serious injuries are measured as a proportion of distance travelled", the paper says. Cyclists injured 21 pedestrians per billion km travelled in 2012 compared with 24 pedestrians injured by drivers.

Read more: http://www.theweek.c

o.uk/uk-news/57065/c

yclists-almost-likel

y-injure-pedestrians

-cars#ixzz355ezvOfI



as for helmets i agree it must be your own choice more so since the transport minsters i think it was put out a statement saying helmets dont help stop injuries, but for anyone under 16 it should be compulsory.
Yeah, I've seen those silly figures before. They completely ignore the fact that the vast majority of car miles are completed on motorways and major A roads where there is never any chance of injuring pedestrians whereas all cycle journeys are completed on pedestrianised roads or even worse, paths where they are forced to share with pedestrians.. You probably need to check the title on the Times website as well. They changed it to 'Motorists and Cyclists' once they realised the point above.

I'll bring up insurance then. Over 1 million drivers are not insured. Virtually all cyclists have liability insurance through their home insurance, it's given away free it is so rarely needed and creates so little damage.

Lights are compulsory, I agree and the police should stop and fine cyclists not using them.
[quote][p][bold]Tony 187[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]JonWya[/bold] wrote: Dear me, the same tired old nonsense on a story about cyclists being victims of dangerous roads. I suppose I should at least attempt to point out some valid points against the comments so far. 1. 'Worst road users going'. Really? How many people do cyclists kill and maim every year? What a silly statement. Drivers kill 3000 people a year and maim tens of thousands. Want to revise your statement yet? If one person a year is killed by a cyclist, that's an unusual year. 2. 'Cyclists holding up traffic'. Every single day there are huge queues holding people up coming in and out of Warrington. Every single day. Bloody cyclists eh? oh no, hang on. It's cars. My mistake. 3. Not many cyclists in Warrington. Not to my reckoning. I see loads but fair enough, that's an anecdotal piece of evidence 4. Helmets should be law. Australia is used by cycling advocates as exactly the reason why helmets shouldn't be mandatory. It stops people cycling, it makes it look dangerous (it isn't) and it actually increases fatalities. There's strong evidence to suggest that by mandating helmets, far more people die from obesity related diseases as a result because they stop cycling. The most common place to receive a serious head injury is inside a car and yet no demands for car helmets... Look, I'm not having a go guys but any suggestions that cyclists are any worse than car drivers is simply nonsense. It's the same people. most cyclists have a driving licenses, it's sometimes they ride a bike as well. We all share the same roads but as this article shows, cyclists are far more vulnerable than car occupants so all that I ask is that drivers respect that cyclists have a right to be there, appreciate the difference they make to the traffic on the roads and just give a little space and time when you see a cyclist. You could even try cycling to work yourself. Warrington has some excellent cycling infrastructure and it really is very enjoyable, not like driving to work is.[/p][/quote]the most important thing you didn't bring up all ROAD users should have insurance of some sort. whether its a 3rd party of some sort. Lights should also be compulsory OH wait they are yet most riders dont use them and a quote from talking point While cars kill five times more pedestrians than bicycles, a rather different picture emerges when "serious injuries are measured as a proportion of distance travelled", the paper says. Cyclists injured 21 pedestrians per billion km travelled in 2012 compared with 24 pedestrians injured by drivers. Read more: http://www.theweek.c o.uk/uk-news/57065/c yclists-almost-likel y-injure-pedestrians -cars#ixzz355ezvOfI as for helmets i agree it must be your own choice more so since the transport minsters i think it was put out a statement saying helmets dont help stop injuries, but for anyone under 16 it should be compulsory.[/p][/quote]Yeah, I've seen those silly figures before. They completely ignore the fact that the vast majority of car miles are completed on motorways and major A roads where there is never any chance of injuring pedestrians whereas all cycle journeys are completed on pedestrianised roads or even worse, paths where they are forced to share with pedestrians.. You probably need to check the title on the Times website as well. They changed it to 'Motorists and Cyclists' once they realised the point above. I'll bring up insurance then. Over 1 million drivers are not insured. Virtually all cyclists have liability insurance through their home insurance, it's given away free it is so rarely needed and creates so little damage. Lights are compulsory, I agree and the police should stop and fine cyclists not using them. JonWya
  • Score: 5

4:47pm Thu 19 Jun 14

gazhopley says...

JonWya wrote:
Dear me, the same tired old nonsense on a story about cyclists being victims of dangerous roads.

I suppose I should at least attempt to point out some valid points against the comments so far.

1. 'Worst road users going'. Really? How many people do cyclists kill and maim every year? What a silly statement. Drivers kill 3000 people a year and maim tens of thousands. Want to revise your statement yet? If one person a year is killed by a cyclist, that's an unusual year.
2. 'Cyclists holding up traffic'. Every single day there are huge queues holding people up coming in and out of Warrington. Every single day. Bloody cyclists eh? oh no, hang on. It's cars. My mistake.
3. Not many cyclists in Warrington. Not to my reckoning. I see loads but fair enough, that's an anecdotal piece of evidence
4. Helmets should be law. Australia is used by cycling advocates as exactly the reason why helmets shouldn't be mandatory. It stops people cycling, it makes it look dangerous (it isn't) and it actually increases fatalities. There's strong evidence to suggest that by mandating helmets, far more people die from obesity related diseases as a result because they stop cycling.
The most common place to receive a serious head injury is inside a car and yet no demands for car helmets...

Look, I'm not having a go guys but any suggestions that cyclists are any worse than car drivers is simply nonsense. It's the same people. most cyclists have a driving licenses, it's sometimes they ride a bike as well. We all share the same roads but as this article shows, cyclists are far more vulnerable than car occupants so all that I ask is that drivers respect that cyclists have a right to be there, appreciate the difference they make to the traffic on the roads and just give a little space and time when you see a cyclist.

You could even try cycling to work yourself. Warrington has some excellent cycling infrastructure and it really is very enjoyable, not like driving to work is.
Ok lets go through this
1. 'Worst road users going'. Really? How many people do cyclists kill and maim every year? What a silly statement. Drivers kill 3000 people a year and maim tens of thousands. Want to revise your statement yet? If one person a year is killed by a cyclist, that's an unusual year.
You say "Drivers kill 3000 people a year" Is it always the motorists fault? Are they attributed for all of those deaths, If a cyclist runs a red light and gets knocked down by a car, even though the cyclist is in more danger it is still the cyclists fault, and in which case if the cyclist dies as a result isn't the motorist a victim too? as they would have to live with the fact that they took the cyclist's life as a consequence of the cyclists decision. This could lead to mental disorders such as depression or anxiety and thus leading to a profound change of the motorist's life, because of that decision made by the cyclist.
"The most common place to receive a serious head injury is inside a car". Really, with law that mandates the compulsory wearing of seatbelts in the front and back and more airbags than a bouncy castle manufacturers, it certainly isn't the most common place to get a head injury.
It is Illegal to ride a bicycle on the pavement (Laws HA 1835 sect 72 & R(S)A 1984, sect 129)
It is illegal to cycle through a red light (Laws RTA 1988 sect 36 & TSRGD reg 10(1) & (Laws RTA 1988 sect 36 & TSRGD regs 10 & 36(1)
What makes cyclists dangerous is they pick and choose which laws they want to follow. Irresponsible drivers who break the law are caught and fined or banned and it will either stop them from being irresponsible or it will get them off the roads to make the roads safer, should it be the same for cyclists? if it cuts down on incidents caused by the cyclist then yes of course it should. only this morning I saw a guy on a bike riding no-handed on a main road while sending a text on his phone, there should be no difference between driving without due care and attention and using a road without due care and attention and it should apply to EVERYONE without discrimination. The less irresponsible PEOPLE there is on the roads the safer it will be.
[quote][p][bold]JonWya[/bold] wrote: Dear me, the same tired old nonsense on a story about cyclists being victims of dangerous roads. I suppose I should at least attempt to point out some valid points against the comments so far. 1. 'Worst road users going'. Really? How many people do cyclists kill and maim every year? What a silly statement. Drivers kill 3000 people a year and maim tens of thousands. Want to revise your statement yet? If one person a year is killed by a cyclist, that's an unusual year. 2. 'Cyclists holding up traffic'. Every single day there are huge queues holding people up coming in and out of Warrington. Every single day. Bloody cyclists eh? oh no, hang on. It's cars. My mistake. 3. Not many cyclists in Warrington. Not to my reckoning. I see loads but fair enough, that's an anecdotal piece of evidence 4. Helmets should be law. Australia is used by cycling advocates as exactly the reason why helmets shouldn't be mandatory. It stops people cycling, it makes it look dangerous (it isn't) and it actually increases fatalities. There's strong evidence to suggest that by mandating helmets, far more people die from obesity related diseases as a result because they stop cycling. The most common place to receive a serious head injury is inside a car and yet no demands for car helmets... Look, I'm not having a go guys but any suggestions that cyclists are any worse than car drivers is simply nonsense. It's the same people. most cyclists have a driving licenses, it's sometimes they ride a bike as well. We all share the same roads but as this article shows, cyclists are far more vulnerable than car occupants so all that I ask is that drivers respect that cyclists have a right to be there, appreciate the difference they make to the traffic on the roads and just give a little space and time when you see a cyclist. You could even try cycling to work yourself. Warrington has some excellent cycling infrastructure and it really is very enjoyable, not like driving to work is.[/p][/quote]Ok lets go through this 1. 'Worst road users going'. Really? How many people do cyclists kill and maim every year? What a silly statement. Drivers kill 3000 people a year and maim tens of thousands. Want to revise your statement yet? If one person a year is killed by a cyclist, that's an unusual year. You say "Drivers kill 3000 people a year" Is it always the motorists fault? Are they attributed for all of those deaths, If a cyclist runs a red light and gets knocked down by a car, even though the cyclist is in more danger it is still the cyclists fault, and in which case if the cyclist dies as a result isn't the motorist a victim too? as they would have to live with the fact that they took the cyclist's life as a consequence of the cyclists decision. This could lead to mental disorders such as depression or anxiety and thus leading to a profound change of the motorist's life, because of that decision made by the cyclist. "The most common place to receive a serious head injury is inside a car". Really, with law that mandates the compulsory wearing of seatbelts in the front and back and more airbags than a bouncy castle manufacturers, it certainly isn't the most common place to get a head injury. It is Illegal to ride a bicycle on the pavement (Laws HA 1835 sect 72 & R(S)A 1984, sect 129) It is illegal to cycle through a red light (Laws RTA 1988 sect 36 & TSRGD reg 10(1) & (Laws RTA 1988 sect 36 & TSRGD regs 10 & 36(1) What makes cyclists dangerous is they pick and choose which laws they want to follow. Irresponsible drivers who break the law are caught and fined or banned and it will either stop them from being irresponsible or it will get them off the roads to make the roads safer, should it be the same for cyclists? if it cuts down on incidents caused by the cyclist then yes of course it should. only this morning I saw a guy on a bike riding no-handed on a main road while sending a text on his phone, there should be no difference between driving without due care and attention and using a road without due care and attention and it should apply to EVERYONE without discrimination. The less irresponsible PEOPLE there is on the roads the safer it will be. gazhopley
  • Score: -1

5:40pm Thu 19 Jun 14

HappyMisery says...

I keep saying this. Often, its car drivers who then cycle who cause the problems. They do not differentiate their position in the road or check blind spots before attempting a manoevre. Only last week I was driving through Risley to Culcheth, preparing to over take a cyclist and without any indication he pulls to the centre of the road to turn right in to a business park. I was below the speed limit but he didn't give me much preparation time to stop by wildly swerving into position and then topped the occasion by making hand gestures at me as though I was at fault for being in a car.

Many years ago, I was taught by road safety officers not to do this, but to pull to the left and wait for the road to clear before turning right, so that you are not the hazard in the centre of the road. Some people just get on a bike and ride like they drive, without the thought that maybe a mistake is likely to cause a bump in a car, but will kill you on a bike.
I keep saying this. Often, its car drivers who then cycle who cause the problems. They do not differentiate their position in the road or check blind spots before attempting a manoevre. Only last week I was driving through Risley to Culcheth, preparing to over take a cyclist and without any indication he pulls to the centre of the road to turn right in to a business park. I was below the speed limit but he didn't give me much preparation time to stop by wildly swerving into position and then topped the occasion by making hand gestures at me as though I was at fault for being in a car. Many years ago, I was taught by road safety officers not to do this, but to pull to the left and wait for the road to clear before turning right, so that you are not the hazard in the centre of the road. Some people just get on a bike and ride like they drive, without the thought that maybe a mistake is likely to cause a bump in a car, but will kill you on a bike. HappyMisery
  • Score: -3

5:55pm Thu 19 Jun 14

gazhopley says...

HappyMisery wrote:
I keep saying this. Often, its car drivers who then cycle who cause the problems. They do not differentiate their position in the road or check blind spots before attempting a manoevre. Only last week I was driving through Risley to Culcheth, preparing to over take a cyclist and without any indication he pulls to the centre of the road to turn right in to a business park. I was below the speed limit but he didn't give me much preparation time to stop by wildly swerving into position and then topped the occasion by making hand gestures at me as though I was at fault for being in a car.

Many years ago, I was taught by road safety officers not to do this, but to pull to the left and wait for the road to clear before turning right, so that you are not the hazard in the centre of the road. Some people just get on a bike and ride like they drive, without the thought that maybe a mistake is likely to cause a bump in a car, but will kill you on a bike.
How do you know the guy on the bike is also a motorist? I see kids all the time doing the same thing.
All kudos for doing the safety course, it's a shame it's not compulsory to take lessons or indeed learn the highway code for cyclists, that would make the roads safer too, although that would never happen as being responsible might put people off cycling. I am a motorist and I have a bicycle too but I won't ride it any more due to the attitude of cycling groups who want safer roads... as long as it's not them who has any responsibility in making it safe, their attitude is dangerous and want no part in their politics.
The only way to make the roads safer is if everyone has responsibility for their actions, whether your'e a motorist, cyclist or pedestrian, to add responsibility to one group only, means a removal from the others and that will never solve the problem... it will only change it's nature.
[quote][p][bold]HappyMisery[/bold] wrote: I keep saying this. Often, its car drivers who then cycle who cause the problems. They do not differentiate their position in the road or check blind spots before attempting a manoevre. Only last week I was driving through Risley to Culcheth, preparing to over take a cyclist and without any indication he pulls to the centre of the road to turn right in to a business park. I was below the speed limit but he didn't give me much preparation time to stop by wildly swerving into position and then topped the occasion by making hand gestures at me as though I was at fault for being in a car. Many years ago, I was taught by road safety officers not to do this, but to pull to the left and wait for the road to clear before turning right, so that you are not the hazard in the centre of the road. Some people just get on a bike and ride like they drive, without the thought that maybe a mistake is likely to cause a bump in a car, but will kill you on a bike.[/p][/quote]How do you know the guy on the bike is also a motorist? I see kids all the time doing the same thing. All kudos for doing the safety course, it's a shame it's not compulsory to take lessons or indeed learn the highway code for cyclists, that would make the roads safer too, although that would never happen as being responsible might put people off cycling. I am a motorist and I have a bicycle too but I won't ride it any more due to the attitude of cycling groups who want safer roads... as long as it's not them who has any responsibility in making it safe, their attitude is dangerous and want no part in their politics. The only way to make the roads safer is if everyone has responsibility for their actions, whether your'e a motorist, cyclist or pedestrian, to add responsibility to one group only, means a removal from the others and that will never solve the problem... it will only change it's nature. gazhopley
  • Score: 3

5:47am Fri 20 Jun 14

MikeJT says...

Bad cyclists are more dangerous than good drivers
Bad drivers are more dangerous than good cyclists
From a risk assessment POV, cars are a more dangerous object than a bicycle

Cyclists v driver argument resolved in a nut shell !
Bad cyclists are more dangerous than good drivers Bad drivers are more dangerous than good cyclists From a risk assessment POV, cars are a more dangerous object than a bicycle Cyclists v driver argument resolved in a nut shell ! MikeJT
  • Score: 3

12:45pm Fri 20 Jun 14

gravitydrips says...

I live in York but come back regularly to Warrington to visit my parents. Cycling in York is huge, and has been for years. Provision for cyclists in York is years ahead of Warrington.
As a cyclist I agree with the criticisms of cyclists. People though must distinguish between 'cyclists' and 'people who just ride a bike'. Cyclists obey the law, are aware of the road and have good situational awareness. They are a minority. The majority are people who ride a bike on main roads as if their riding a bike on a pavement when they were five years old. I myself have had a number of near misses with other cyclists who were just plain stupid, and it is these people who give 'cyclists' a bad name.
To make the roads of Warrington safe for cyclists takes more than a council produced cycle road map. Im sorry, but the provision for cyclists in Warrington, in comparison to places like York or Oxford, just doesn't exist. For this to change, the council would have to spend millions on road and footpath alterations, and I can't see how or why the council tax payers of Warrington would support that expenditure.
I live in York but come back regularly to Warrington to visit my parents. Cycling in York is huge, and has been for years. Provision for cyclists in York is years ahead of Warrington. As a cyclist I agree with the criticisms of cyclists. People though must distinguish between 'cyclists' and 'people who just ride a bike'. Cyclists obey the law, are aware of the road and have good situational awareness. They are a minority. The majority are people who ride a bike on main roads as if their riding a bike on a pavement when they were five years old. I myself have had a number of near misses with other cyclists who were just plain stupid, and it is these people who give 'cyclists' a bad name. To make the roads of Warrington safe for cyclists takes more than a council produced cycle road map. Im sorry, but the provision for cyclists in Warrington, in comparison to places like York or Oxford, just doesn't exist. For this to change, the council would have to spend millions on road and footpath alterations, and I can't see how or why the council tax payers of Warrington would support that expenditure. gravitydrips
  • Score: 3

3:49pm Fri 20 Jun 14

gazhopley says...

gravitydrips wrote:
I live in York but come back regularly to Warrington to visit my parents. Cycling in York is huge, and has been for years. Provision for cyclists in York is years ahead of Warrington.
As a cyclist I agree with the criticisms of cyclists. People though must distinguish between 'cyclists' and 'people who just ride a bike'. Cyclists obey the law, are aware of the road and have good situational awareness. They are a minority. The majority are people who ride a bike on main roads as if their riding a bike on a pavement when they were five years old. I myself have had a number of near misses with other cyclists who were just plain stupid, and it is these people who give 'cyclists' a bad name.
To make the roads of Warrington safe for cyclists takes more than a council produced cycle road map. Im sorry, but the provision for cyclists in Warrington, in comparison to places like York or Oxford, just doesn't exist. For this to change, the council would have to spend millions on road and footpath alterations, and I can't see how or why the council tax payers of Warrington would support that expenditure.
I agree with you in most part, yes Warrington was designed when the motor industry was booming and as the old saying goes "Hindsight is a wonderful thing" but...
"People though must distinguish between 'cyclists' and 'people who just ride a bike". THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE. I will explain why. There are different types of motorist, Some use their cars to commute, or may drive professionally as a courier perhaps, some just use their cars for recreation for a day out in the country for example, but they are ALL still motorists. There are different types of cyclist, some use their bikes to commute or may cycle professionally as a courier perhaps, some just use their bikes for recreation for a day out in the country for example, but they are ALL still cyclists.
As you pointed out in your comment the " Cyclists obey the law, are aware of the road and have good situational awareness. They are a minority."
So if the majority of cyclists don't do what you stated shouldn't this be addressed in the name of road safety by the cycling community, A good motorist will always want the bad motorist off the streets to make them safer. Does a good cyclist say the same about their bad cyclists?
[quote][p][bold]gravitydrips[/bold] wrote: I live in York but come back regularly to Warrington to visit my parents. Cycling in York is huge, and has been for years. Provision for cyclists in York is years ahead of Warrington. As a cyclist I agree with the criticisms of cyclists. People though must distinguish between 'cyclists' and 'people who just ride a bike'. Cyclists obey the law, are aware of the road and have good situational awareness. They are a minority. The majority are people who ride a bike on main roads as if their riding a bike on a pavement when they were five years old. I myself have had a number of near misses with other cyclists who were just plain stupid, and it is these people who give 'cyclists' a bad name. To make the roads of Warrington safe for cyclists takes more than a council produced cycle road map. Im sorry, but the provision for cyclists in Warrington, in comparison to places like York or Oxford, just doesn't exist. For this to change, the council would have to spend millions on road and footpath alterations, and I can't see how or why the council tax payers of Warrington would support that expenditure.[/p][/quote]I agree with you in most part, yes Warrington was designed when the motor industry was booming and as the old saying goes "Hindsight is a wonderful thing" but... "People though must distinguish between 'cyclists' and 'people who just ride a bike". THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE. I will explain why. There are different types of motorist, Some use their cars to commute, or may drive professionally as a courier perhaps, some just use their cars for recreation for a day out in the country for example, but they are ALL still motorists. There are different types of cyclist, some use their bikes to commute or may cycle professionally as a courier perhaps, some just use their bikes for recreation for a day out in the country for example, but they are ALL still cyclists. As you pointed out in your comment the " Cyclists obey the law, are aware of the road and have good situational awareness. They are a minority." So if the majority of cyclists don't do what you stated shouldn't this be addressed in the name of road safety by the cycling community, A good motorist will always want the bad motorist off the streets to make them safer. Does a good cyclist say the same about their bad cyclists? gazhopley
  • Score: 0

3:58pm Fri 20 Jun 14

gazhopley says...

MikeJT wrote:
Bad cyclists are more dangerous than good drivers
Bad drivers are more dangerous than good cyclists
From a risk assessment POV, cars are a more dangerous object than a bicycle

Cyclists v driver argument resolved in a nut shell !
Cars are more dangerous than bikes as an object but there are more good drivers than bad drivers and as Gravitydrips said there are more bad cyclists than there are good so who is the most dangerous group the drivers or the cyclists relative to their overall numbers?
[quote][p][bold]MikeJT[/bold] wrote: Bad cyclists are more dangerous than good drivers Bad drivers are more dangerous than good cyclists From a risk assessment POV, cars are a more dangerous object than a bicycle Cyclists v driver argument resolved in a nut shell ![/p][/quote]Cars are more dangerous than bikes as an object but there are more good drivers than bad drivers and as Gravitydrips said there are more bad cyclists than there are good so who is the most dangerous group the drivers or the cyclists relative to their overall numbers? gazhopley
  • Score: -3

1:29pm Sat 21 Jun 14

SankeyB says...

My problem with cyclists is the number that do not obey the rules of the road. I've lost count of the number I've seen ride right through red lights as if they just didn't apply to them. Not that long ago I was stopped at a red light and saw a pedestrian nearly knocked over by a cyclist riding right through the red light. Luckily he avoided the pedestrian but if he'd hit him it would have been a very nasty accident with the speed he was going.
My problem with cyclists is the number that do not obey the rules of the road. I've lost count of the number I've seen ride right through red lights as if they just didn't apply to them. Not that long ago I was stopped at a red light and saw a pedestrian nearly knocked over by a cyclist riding right through the red light. Luckily he avoided the pedestrian but if he'd hit him it would have been a very nasty accident with the speed he was going. SankeyB
  • Score: 1

2:44pm Sat 21 Jun 14

fedster says...

so your saying it all comes down to professionalism of cyclist ?

like the pro teams we see on a weekend riding 3 abreast down country lanes so you cant over take.

at the end of the day i use a camera in the car, the amount of stupid cyclist ive gotten on video is shocking (in fact more stupid cyclist than stupid car drivers)

and thats saying something.
so your saying it all comes down to professionalism of cyclist ? like the pro teams we see on a weekend riding 3 abreast down country lanes so you cant over take. at the end of the day i use a camera in the car, the amount of stupid cyclist ive gotten on video is shocking (in fact more stupid cyclist than stupid car drivers) and thats saying something. fedster
  • Score: 2

4:33pm Sat 21 Jun 14

brabazon says...

Wigan Council have just spent a fortune on narrowing a prime route to extend the pavements. What for ?? so cyclists can ride on the pavement in a cycle lane. You can go days without seeing a cyclist on the roads of Wigan. Why do it ? because the Government have given money out to Councils who do this. We now have mirrors on traffic lights and cycle paths on pavements, cyclists win again.
Wigan Council have just spent a fortune on narrowing a prime route to extend the pavements. What for ?? so cyclists can ride on the pavement in a cycle lane. You can go days without seeing a cyclist on the roads of Wigan. Why do it ? because the Government have given money out to Councils who do this. We now have mirrors on traffic lights and cycle paths on pavements, cyclists win again. brabazon
  • Score: 0

2:08pm Sun 22 Jun 14

gordon holt says...

ban all cyclists, tell them to buy a car, four wheels is much safer
ban all cyclists, tell them to buy a car, four wheels is much safer gordon holt
  • Score: -4

2:56pm Mon 23 Jun 14

Geordie1970 says...

SankeyB wrote:
My problem with cyclists is the number that do not obey the rules of the road. I've lost count of the number I've seen ride right through red lights as if they just didn't apply to them. Not that long ago I was stopped at a red light and saw a pedestrian nearly knocked over by a cyclist riding right through the red light. Luckily he avoided the pedestrian but if he'd hit him it would have been a very nasty accident with the speed he was going.
I see car drivers going through red lights on a daily basis.

Everyone's got a bad cyclist story, so it's easy to slag them off.

I drive cars, motorbikes and cycle, and car drivers are the biggest problems on the road by far.
[quote][p][bold]SankeyB[/bold] wrote: My problem with cyclists is the number that do not obey the rules of the road. I've lost count of the number I've seen ride right through red lights as if they just didn't apply to them. Not that long ago I was stopped at a red light and saw a pedestrian nearly knocked over by a cyclist riding right through the red light. Luckily he avoided the pedestrian but if he'd hit him it would have been a very nasty accident with the speed he was going.[/p][/quote]I see car drivers going through red lights on a daily basis. Everyone's got a bad cyclist story, so it's easy to slag them off. I drive cars, motorbikes and cycle, and car drivers are the biggest problems on the road by far. Geordie1970
  • Score: 1

8:02am Wed 25 Jun 14

SAC_in_Warrington says...

Cyclists should be stopped from riding on pavements.
Cyclists should be stopped from riding on pavements. SAC_in_Warrington
  • Score: 0

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