Opponents and supporters lined up for HS2 plan

Opponents and supporters lined up for HS2 plan Opponents and supporters lined up for HS2 plan

HS2 - the high speed rail network linking London to the north - will come through Warrington - but not how campaigners had hoped.

On Monday the Government unveiled its preferred route for the 225mph line to the region with only stations planned for Crewe, Manchester and Manchester Airport in the north west.

But as part of the links up to the West Coast Mainline in Wigan the line could cut through the eastern edge of the borough from Warburton, Glazebrook and Culcheth up to the Lowton border.

The plans are the initial footprints for the £32billion scheme which is due to open in 2032.

The Government and HS2 Ltd will work with MPs, local authorities and including environment and heritage organisations to refine the proposals along with a large public consultation.

The final route will be chosen by the end of 2014.

The proposal has split many in the town who are for and against the plans.

PARKLAND could be carved up by the proposed new high speed railway line as it slices through the east of the borough.

The Friends of Culcheth Linear Park say they are devastated by the plans for HS2 to cut through the green space.

Chairman Sally Probert said: “It is part of the proposed rail link to Wigan rather than the main Manchester link that affects us. It will cut in to the park for a few hundred metres.

“Unfortunately the old map that the government planners are using shows the area as a disused railway line and not as beautiful and well used park for the local people to use.

“We have over the last few years raised tens of thousands of pounds to help drain the park and make it more user friendly for the many dog walkers, joggers, walkers and children to walk and play in it.”

While Cheshire Wildlife Trust say the railway could put the borough’s most valued and fragile habitats at risk.

It has raised fears over Holcroft Moss nature reserve near Risley Moss - the last remaining peat bog in the county that has not been ‘cut over’ or affected by peat extraction works.

Director of conservation Charlotte Harris said: “We’re keen to understand from HS2 how they propose to minimise the impact on our Holcroft Moss reserve with the line passing extremely close to the south west corner.

“These are wild places that shouldn’t fall under the rails.”

 

FASTER travel times to London and a positive impact on the borough’s economy will roll into town on the high speed railway line.

Warrington will see travel times reduced by 30 minutes to the capital even though the borough missed out on becoming a stopping point on the route - despite lobbying from council bosses.

Announcing the route on Monday Transport Secretary Patrick McLoughlin said: “High Speed Rail is an unparalleled opportunity to secure a step-change in Britain’s competitiveness and this Government will do everything possible to ensure that Warrington benefits by getting the connections they need and deserve to thrive.”

And industry experts believe some properties could benefit from the new line with properties in places like Lymm only 10 minutes away from a new station at Manchester Airport where trains are less than an hour to London.

David Thrower, a retired transport consultant from Stockton Heath, said: “Some people might choose to drive to Manchester Airport and some house prices will go up rather than down thanks to that fast link.

“The vast majority of residents will also benefit in terms of an economic impact and it makes Warrington an even more attractive place for businesses.

“We will have train services that will use the line and will connect at Crewe to the West Coast Mainline so we don’t need a new station if you get a train from Bank Quay to connect with the line.”

Comments(10)

old-codger says...
3:20pm Fri 1 Feb 13

HS2 - the high speed rail network linking London to the north - will come through Warrington - but not how campaigners had hoped. ......

So it goe,s through Warburton, Glazebrook,and Culcheth. It doesnt come to or through Warrington.
It just goe,s at speed through the corner of the borough.
Hardly beneficial to the town is it. Just rips up parkland and nature reserves.

Karlar says...
7:41pm Fri 1 Feb 13

If HS2 is set to bring untold benefits to the northwest, including Warrington, why was it necessary for a judge to order the HS2 company - set up by ministers to run the controversial £33billion high speed line – to make public details about how far from the track it is allowing ‘exceptional hardship’ compensation claims.Today a tribunal judge said it was time HS2 Ltd treated the public like grown ups’ and credit them with having enough intelligence not to ‘misunderstand’ the requested data.
If the benefits of HS2 outweigh the problems why the secrecy? What is there to hide? If this vital infrastructure project will apparently solve all our financial problems we should know everything there is to know about it.Or could it be there are some aspects of it that are best kept secret, because it is not all it's been cracked to be?

Dr Beeching says...
12:44pm Sat 2 Feb 13

These people are priceless.

Let's do the maths :-

Warrington to Crewe - 20 minutes

Waiting time for connection (which will include buffer time/transition) let's say - 20 minutes

Journey time Crewe to Euston - 50 minutes

Total time : 90 minutes

Current Virgin direct service from Bank Quay to Euston normally : 105 minutes

So the benefit to Warrington is 15 minutes at best.

I think we can pass on this one.

ChrisNorthWest says...
3:15pm Sat 2 Feb 13

Dr Beeching:

I'm not sure you understand what is being proposed. There will be no waiting time at Crewe.

It is proposed that trains will stop at Warrington Bank Quay after arriving from Preston and Wigan. These trains will then continue to Crewe on the existing at which point they will join directly onto the new HS2 line going south.

So, non-stop Warrington could see a journey time of around 1 hour 20 minutes, (20 minutes to Crewe give or take, 58 minutes from Crewe to London). If the train stops to pick up passengers at Crewe before joining the line, the time will be around 1 hour 25.

I would also like to point out that HS2 will provide much needed West Coast capacity, which is the main reason we need to build a new line in the first place.

Dr Beeching says...
12:56pm Sun 3 Feb 13

Whichever way you look at the scheme, its a lot of money for a 20-25 minute saving in time for Warrington users.

You mention much needed West Coast capacity - I got out of a virtually empty carriage (17.57hrs Euston to Warrington) at 19.50hrs last Friday evening and as a weekly user this is not unusual. Where's the evidence ?

I'm assuming the Government are allocating similar amounts of money to the repair of a deteriorating road network, sea defences and flood protection schemes across the country. Thought not !

Steve Parish says...
8:55pm Tue 5 Feb 13

It's about ten times the annual budget spent on motorways and trunk roads, so a long way short of what has been spent on roads. I can't quite recall the formula from my days on British Rail but there was always a correlation between shorter journey times and increase in passengers (because it drew people off roads). I think it was 1% time saved = 1% extra users.

Interestingly, while the internet means travel for face-to-face meetings should be less needed, it also means you can now be on a train and safely doing office work while you travel.

strimmer says...
6:02pm Thu 7 Feb 13

ChrisNorthWest - The HS2 line will circumnavigate Warrington Bank Quay. I don't believe any HS2 trains will run through Bank Quay. They will travel up the new line to Wigan where they will then pick up the existing West Coast Mainline for onward journeys to Glasgow.
To travel to London Euston, commuters from Warrington will either (1) drive to Manchester Airport or Central Manchester to pick up the direct HS2 trains or (2) pick up a commuter train to either Crewe or Birmingham to pick up HS2. Either way there's little benefit in terms of time.... and HS2 cost will be off-putting / expensive.
In terms of West Coast Mainline capacity..... This is a complete nonsense. The figures have been released after severe legal pressure from campaigners. The West Coast line is running at only 60% capacity in PEAK times. Euston is one of London's most under utilised stations.
Warrington (and Liverpool) is getting a very poor deal here... and we're also losing some of our Green Belt land to boot. Feels like a kick in the teeth and we should be strongly objecting.
The WCM should be improved northwards from Crewe. Forget this silly spur route!

Steve Parish says...
9:55pm Thu 7 Feb 13

I'm not sure, Strimmer, when you say you don't believe HS2 trains will run through Bank Quay, whether you mean that's how you understand the proposals (in which case you're wrong), or you do understand the proposals but think they're lying!

Trains from Scotland will be non-stop from Preston to London, onto HS2 south of Wigan. There will be HS2 trains from Preston to London, calling at Wigan, Warrington and Crewe and joining the HS2 line south of Crewe. Warrington may lose its direct services to north of Preston.

I'm not sure by what measure you think Euston is under utilised. It's had 3 new platforms to cope with the number of trains, though I think you may have in mind the fact that most passengers using Euston actually can get a seat on trains (whereas other London terminals have lots of peak hour trains with people standing).

strimmer says...
1:41pm Fri 8 Feb 13

Steve P – Sorry, still beg to differ, but from all the reading I’ve done HS2 trains will NOT run through Warrington Bank Quay. What will are referred to as “Classic Compatible” trains. These are shorter and slower than the “Captive” HS2 trains (Ref: High Speed Rail, London to the West Midlands and Beyond, HS2 Technical Appendix). Trains from Scotland will be “Classic Compatible” not “Captive” (i.e. true) HS2.

From the HS2 maps even trains starting their journeys south from Preston will need to be “Classic Compatible” as the new proposed HS2 line in Phase 2 doesn’t reach as far north as Preston. Therefore, I would still strongly question the need for this stretch of HS2 railway line circumnavigating Warrington.

In terms of Capacity - Network Rail’s latest figures, published in 2012, show Euston as the least busy London domestic long-distance station – using just 60 per cent of capacity in the three-hour morning peak, compared to equivalent figures at Paddington and Waterloo stations of over 100 per cent at peak times.
These figures are consistent with the findings of a 2011 independent study
which showed Virgin’s peak evening services from Euston are only 56 per cent full and Manchester trains only 45 per cent.
The 60 per cent capacity figures are all before taking into account the additional capacity provided by improvements currently being implemented on the WCML which involve lengthening 31 out of the existing 52 Pendolino units (by adding
two standard class carriages) and also providing four new 11 carriage trains.
These improvements will provide 106 more coaches in total. When these improvements are made, occupancy on the WCML will be just 35 per cent.

We’ve been here before….Britain's first high-speed rail line (HS1) was built on "hugely optimistic" forecasts for passenger demand that never materialised, leaving taxpayers exposed to billions in losses, according to the National Audit Office (NAO).

Steve Parish says...
9:50am Wed 13 Feb 13

Classic compatible trains are compatible between HS2 and the existing "classic" network. They'd be shorter than the "captive" trains (they have to fit existing platforms and work existing signalling systems) and they'd be slower when not on the new HS2 tracks, but do the same 360kph on HS2 as the "captive" trains. You can't have slower trains on HS2 without ruining the capacity of the line. (It's in the technical appendix you refer to.)

The bit from near High Legh to Wigan (through Culcheth) means journey times from Preston and north thereof would save about 20 minutes (assuming they didn't stop at Crewe, Warrington and Wigan). Whether it's worth it is another matter, but that's the justification. (I presume the route went via High Legh rather than more directly toward Manchester to allow the spur back to the Preston line to be as short as possible.)

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